October 2011 Blog Carnival: Making The Loot Part Of The Plot
This month’s Blog Carnival – hosted here at Campaign Mastery – is on the subject of “Making The Loot Part Of The Plot”. There’s a reason for that – Johnn & I were debating what makes the best subjects for carnivals shortly after we last hosted one. His contention was (in essence) that the best carnivals focussed on a relatively narrow topic, while I held that a carnival that was capable of multiple interpretations and was more inspiring in theme would garner more and better submissions.
Ultimately, we reached the point of challenging each other to back up our assertions, but past history didn’t provide enough evidence either way to reach any firm conclusions. Since Johnn wanted our sister-site, Roleplaying Tips to host a month of the blog carnival anyway, and the following slot was also up for grabs, we decided to put it to a back-to-back test.
Along came Assassin’s Amulet, and the whole plan got kicked into a cocked hat, as every opportunity that was available got subordinated to the marketing and promotional needs of that megaproject. Johnn was able to change the planned subject of Roleplaying Tips’ carnival at the last moment – in fact, after I had written CM’s entry for the carnival! – and the rest of the story you know.
So here we are, a comparison without a referant. Good thing we both insisted that the subjects be worthy topics of a Blog Carnival…
Making The Loot Part Of The Plot
In “old school” GMing, as exemplified by the few commercial modules that I had purchased and by the games that I had played, the Loot was a payoff and a bribe to the PCs to keep adventuring – simultaniously a score-keeping mechanism and a tool to enhance and upgrade PC capabilities, a byproduct of the adventure. This model was later adopted by computer-based RPGs like Diablo.
One of the first changes that I made to my DMing style was to attempt to go beyond that model, making the Loot an essential part of the plotline. It’s ironic that in modern times, one of the biggest complaints that I hear about new players coming into the game is that they have this same attitude, deriving from their computer-based gaming experiences. Tabletop RPG’ers have no-one to blame for this situation but themselves.
So, what sort of specific subjects am I hoping to see in this month’s Blog Carnival?
- Loot as an aid to tone setting
- Loot as a plot seed
- Conecting adventures through loot
- Types of treasure – non-material rewards
- The consequences of possession
- Connecting Treasure to campaign history
- The difficulty of maintaining mystery concerning the capabilities of loot
- You have it, they want it – people who want to share the wealth
- Treasure maps – making and interpreting them
- Writeups of rare knicknacks & other mundane treasures
- The valuation of loot
- 101 uses for a monster carcass
- The impact of rarity on value
- Loot placement
- Safeguarding the loot – the art of trap emplacement
- Original Artefacts
- The impact on campaign history of Artefacts
- Loot that’s not for everyone – treasures that require skill to utilise
- Indirect Buffing of characters
- The power of plus 1
- Tightening Focus in loot capabilities vs Smaller more generic abilities
- Power Standards in Treasure Ability
- Loot Superstitions
- The absence of Loot – reducing payouts without annoying players
- The economics of Loot
….the list just keeps growing
And, of course, here at CM, we’re still in Assassin’s Amulet mode – so I’ll be talking about Legacy Items. But I also have something to say on most of those topics – and nowhere near enough time to get to all of them in the month. In fact, it occurs to me, looking over that list, that there’s room out there for a blog that does nothing BUT talk about loot in all it’s manifest forms…
I look forward to reading the posts!
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October 3rd, 2011 at 11:59 am
Okee dokee!
http://elthosrpg.blogspot.com/2011/10/making-loot-part-of-plot.html
:)
October 3rd, 2011 at 3:53 pm
Okay…maybe I”m being a little dense but what exactly is a blog carnival :)
October 4th, 2011 at 12:33 am
@ Vivian: Each month, a different blog hosts the carnival. They nominate a subject on which a whole heap of other blogs (as well as themselves) write an article during the course of the month. As each article gets posted, the blog that posted it sends a link back to the hosting website – like the one from vbwrde, above. At the end of the month, the website does a huge dump of all the articles on the subject.
Mike recently posted..October 2011 Blog Carnival: Making The Loot Part Of The Plot
October 4th, 2011 at 7:31 am
[…] month’s RPG Blog Carnival hosted by Campaign Mastery is “Making the Loot Part of the Plot.” As they describe in their overview article, this topic can be applied broadly to a lot of games […]
October 4th, 2011 at 7:47 am
Here is the Dungeon’s Master contribution to this month’s RPG Blog Carnival.
7 Adventure Hooks for Making the Loot Part of the Plot: RPG Blog Carnival
Ameron recently posted..7 Adventure Hooks for Making the Loot Part of the Plot: RPG Blog Carnival
October 4th, 2011 at 12:20 pm
Loot! A subject near and dear to my heart! I’m sure I’ll have a host of posts for this Blog Carnival.
October 4th, 2011 at 3:50 pm
[…] this months RPG Blog carnival centers on something near and dear to every intrepid adventurer. The Loot. You know something is […]
October 4th, 2011 at 7:28 pm
Here’s the Huntersquarry.com contribution to the carnival. Happy blogging and thanks for hosting this month!
http://huntersquarry.wordpress.com/2011/10/04/rpg-blog-carnival-loot-as-part-of-the-plot/
October 5th, 2011 at 5:03 am
[…] Mike at Campaign Mastery has kicked off this month’s RPG Blog Carnival, and it’s all about loot. How can you use loot to forward the story vs. simply working as the carrot at the end of the stick for your players? […]
October 5th, 2011 at 6:08 am
Some real fun this month! Plot hooks on treasure only scratches the surface doesn’t it.
All That Glitters… is my contribution so far.
Thanks for hosting!
satyre recently posted..all that glitters…
October 5th, 2011 at 7:43 am
Awesome topic. Just posted my contribution so far:
http://www.gameknightreviews.com/2011/10/the-gassy-gnoll-whered-that-come-from-blog-carnival-making-the-loot-part-of-the-plot/
October 5th, 2011 at 9:02 am
[…] This month’s topic, Making Loot a Part of the Plot, is sponsored by Campaign Mastery. […]
October 5th, 2011 at 2:31 pm
[…] Inspired by the blog carnival, Making Loot Part of the Plot. […]
October 5th, 2011 at 2:45 pm
http://githyankidiaspora.wordpress.com/2011/10/05/mo-gold-pieces-mo-problems/
Mo’ Gold Pieces, Mo’ Problems…I’m almost positive I’ve written a blog post with that title before. Huh.
October 6th, 2011 at 4:37 pm
[…] but I think his latest “Legends and Lore” article actually falls in line with the current RPG Blog Carnival topic – Making Loot part of the Plot. Magic items always have the potential to imbalance a game, but they can also be used to make […]
October 7th, 2011 at 8:55 pm
[…] October 2011 Blog Carnival: Making The Loot Part Of The Plot (campaignmastery.com) […]
October 7th, 2011 at 9:03 pm
Solid topic, and broadly applicable – good call!
Looting Characters~
October 10th, 2011 at 10:23 am
Loot As A Plot Mechanic
Mike recently posted..Making The Loot Part Of The Plot: Loot as a plot mechanic
October 11th, 2011 at 3:30 pm
I found it kind of telling the poll results over at Legends and Lore article by Monte Cook for last week. http://www.wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4ll/20111011
Over 80% of respondants believed Magical Items were a reward rather an step in character progression. And here we are talking about how loot can and should be more about plot then simply a reward. Life is kinda funny huh?
TheRandomDM recently posted..TST: Numismatics
October 11th, 2011 at 7:20 pm
@TheRandomGM: There are two possible explanations for those survey results, not mutually exclusive:
(1) The survey results have been corrupted because the survey is oversimplified, offering only the two choices. What we’re talking about here is a third answer. But the fact is – as I identified in the article linked to below – that many players and GMs feel a sense of entitlement about the bestowing of awards. This can even be thought of by some as a bribe for cooperative behaviour, in a worst-case scenario.
(2) The survey results are a compelling arguement concerning the scope of the problem that this month’s blog carnival is intended to address. What the results suggest to me is that up to 80% of players and GMs are missing a bet – and that once they are clued in, their games will be the better for it.
Mike recently posted..Making The Loot Part Of The Plot: Loot as a plot mechanic
October 11th, 2011 at 7:54 pm
Here’s the link to the article that defines the context of that poll:
http://www.wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4ll/20111004
He’s specifically talking 4E, which has a much different magic item treasure system than previous editions. I do not know the system, but inferring from the article it seems in 4E the magic items are put in the Player’s Handbook and the players pick them during level-up?
Just want to call that out, to help interpret the survey.
And to the discussion here, I feel the best magic items are both plot and reward, though I need to do that more often in Riddleport.
For example, the pally in my Riddleport game looted a silver sword from a githyanki captain. Turns out the sword is cursed. He took two negative levels and needed to perform some quests to purge the levels and unlock a few latent powers in the sword.
October 11th, 2011 at 9:38 pm
That makes the results even more relevant to the carnical, Johnn – thanks! It seems to me that people responding to the poll were often talking at cross purposes – assuming that the tail came with the dog as it were. They favoured treating magic items as part of the character progression for all sorts of reasons outside the scope and context of the original question – game balance being one of the big ones. I feel more strongly than ever that the problem – which Monte identifies in his article – is a sense of entitlement. Where the responses and the survey in general go off the rails is in assuming that it is an either/or choice: that you can either satisfy that sense of entitlement OR have magic items be plot elements, not both.
Mike recently posted..Making The Loot Part Of The Plot: Loot as a plot mechanic
October 12th, 2011 at 5:24 am
http://fictivefantasies.wordpress.com/2011/10/12/mark-of-station-blog-carnival-loot-as-part-of-the-plot/
I have several upcoming posts for the carnival.
fictivefantasies recently posted..Mark of Station. (Blog Carnival: Loot as Part of the Plot)
October 12th, 2011 at 6:44 am
That’s Great, fictivefantasies! Keep ’em coming!
October 13th, 2011 at 6:37 am
http://fictivefantasies.wordpress.com/2011/10/13/no-printing-press-blog-carnival-loot-as-part-of-the-plot/
fictivefantasies recently posted..No Printing Press. (Blog Carnival: Loot as Part of the Plot)
October 14th, 2011 at 10:03 am
I’m giving this Blog Carnival thing a shot: http://z-toast.blogspot.com/2011/10/rpg-blog-carnival-october.html
October 14th, 2011 at 10:32 am
An escellent first post, Orion – welcome to the Carnival!
October 14th, 2011 at 4:52 pm
http://fictivefantasies.wordpress.com/2011/10/14/the-world-is-loot-blog-carnival-loot-as-part-of-the-plot/
fictivefantasies recently posted..The World is Loot (Blog Carnival: Loot as Part of the Plot)
October 14th, 2011 at 8:34 pm
[…] by the October 2011 Blog Carnival: Making The Loot Part Of The Plot. I will be talking about working magic items into a game as plot devices. This can be done in a […]
October 14th, 2011 at 8:50 pm
My contribution:
https://seaofstarsrpg.wordpress.com/2011/10/14/magic-items-as-plot-devices/
October 16th, 2011 at 6:51 pm
One of our bloggers made a carnival post! We may have more incoming depending on if anybody else gets motivated!
http://www.houserule.com/?p=341
October 16th, 2011 at 8:45 pm
@Lee Dvorak: The more, the merrier! Welcome aboard!
October 18th, 2011 at 5:28 am
Here is the next one!
fictivefantasies recently posted..Magic Shouldn’t Work So Hard. (Blog Carnival: Loot as Part of the Plot)
October 18th, 2011 at 7:28 am
Fantastic, fictivefantasies! You’re really getting lots of mileage out of the blog carnival!
October 19th, 2011 at 5:13 am
Glad you like it! Here’s another.
fictivefantasies recently posted..Overpaid Killers. (Blog Carnival: Loot as Part of the Plot)
October 20th, 2011 at 7:52 pm
Another post on House Rule, this time it’s from me!
http://www.houserule.com/?p=351
Lee Dvorak recently posted..Iconic weapons, or, give everybody the Sword of Kas!
October 25th, 2011 at 2:01 am
[…] I made it to this month’s. It’s over at Campaign Mastery now, and the theme is “Making the loot part of the plot”. I’ll admit, loot was never really a driver for me; I spent most of the last few years in […]
October 25th, 2011 at 7:04 pm
Jeff made a loot post, it even has Drizzt spoilers (As if there was anybody who could have anything Drizzt related spoiled).
Lee Dvorak recently posted..Loot: Mystery and Freedom
October 26th, 2011 at 2:03 am
[…] Shinies Posted by Ravyn on October 26, 2011 Yesterday, in response to the RPG Blog Carnival on making loot part of the plot, I talked about the kinds of plots that a piece of loot could be used to create, whether it’s […]
October 26th, 2011 at 5:23 am
I have several posts this month.
http://hackslashmaster.blogspot.com/2011/10/on-magic-weapon-table-part-iii.html <- Sword Special Purpose
http://hackslashmaster.blogspot.com/2011/10/on-riches-causing-ruin.html
http://hackslashmaster.blogspot.com/2011/10/on-distribution-of-wealth.html
http://hackslashmaster.blogspot.com/2011/10/on-sample-hordes.html
http://hackslashmaster.blogspot.com/2011/10/on-generation-of-treasure.html
Thanks for the time and attention.
October 26th, 2011 at 7:18 pm
Here’s my entry for Roleplaying Tips:
3 Minute Magic Items
Johnn recently posted..Kingdom Events For 4 Seasons
October 27th, 2011 at 2:51 pm
[…] topic for this month’s RPG Blog Carnival is Making Loot Part of the Plot being hosted by Campaign Mastery. For more details about the RPG Blog Carnival visit the […]
October 27th, 2011 at 2:53 pm
http://wp.me/p1flGZ-a6
A simple little post on the topic.
4649matt recently posted..Trick or Treat – October 2011 RPG Blog Carnival
October 29th, 2011 at 6:45 pm
[…] Applications (Swag!) Posted by Ravyn on October 29, 2011 In honor of the RPG Blog Carnival on making loot part of the plot, and the posts I’ve already done on the types of plots loot can be at the center of and what […]
October 30th, 2011 at 12:36 am
You’ve probably already seen the trackbacks, but here are my three.
http://www.exchangeofrealities.com/2011/10/25/what-loot-can-do-with-your-plot/
http://www.exchangeofrealities.com/2011/10/26/impress-me-with-your-shinies/
http://www.exchangeofrealities.com/2011/10/29/impractical-applications-swag/
Thanks for an enjoyable topic!
Ravyn recently posted..Impractical Applications (Swag!)
October 30th, 2011 at 9:42 am
My pleasure, Ravyn! There has been so much response, and I still have so many topics up my sleeve for articles, I might even run the same subject again next time CM hosts the Carnival…
October 31st, 2011 at 9:39 am
Well, I didn’t complete the Hoard project in October, but I continue to plug away at it. But the Random Dm has built up a bunch of tables to help develop your big pile of loot.
Hoard Project
October 31st, 2011 at 9:10 pm
Another entry for the carnival:
Magic Item Contest
November 1st, 2011 at 7:33 am
[…] month’s RPG Blog Carnival hosted by Campaign Mastery is “Making the Loot Part of the Plot.” The Dungeon’s Master contribution was 7 Adventure Hooks for Making the Loot Part of the […]
November 7th, 2011 at 5:02 am
[…] October 2011 Blog Carnival: Making The Loot Part Of The Plot (campaignmastery.com) […]
January 1st, 2016 at 1:59 pm
[…] October 2011 Blog Carnival: Making The Loot Part Of The Plot (campaignmastery.com) […]
January 1st, 2016 at 2:35 pm
[…] but I think his latest “Legends and Lore” article actually falls in line with the current RPG Blog Carnival topic – Making Loot part of the Plot. Magic items always have the potential to imbalance a game, but they can also be used to make […]
January 1st, 2016 at 2:35 pm
[…] Mike at Campaign Mastery has kicked off this month’s RPG Blog Carnival, and it’s all about loot. How can you use loot to forward the story vs. simply working as the carrot at the end of the stick for your players? […]