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	<title>Comments on: Are Special Effects Killing Hollywood?</title>
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	<link>http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/hollywood-effects/</link>
	<description>Expert tips and how-to's on every aspect of creating and running exceptional campaigns.</description>
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		<title>By: Paul singleton</title>
		<link>http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/hollywood-effects/comment-page-1/#comment-215</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul singleton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Feb 2009 06:52:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/?p=110#comment-215</guid>
		<description>Ok but my favourite movies are fight club and pulp fiction not too many special effects but fantastic story line and characters.  I admit that lord of the rings, matrix and Alien are great and the best of both worlds they have a fantastic characters and story line and special effects  but I think 80% of the new movies concentrate to much on special effects and no story line. 
Paul</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ok but my favourite movies are fight club and pulp fiction not too many special effects but fantastic story line and characters.  I admit that lord of the rings, matrix and Alien are great and the best of both worlds they have a fantastic characters and story line and special effects  but I think 80% of the new movies concentrate to much on special effects and no story line.<br />
Paul</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Bourke</title>
		<link>http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/hollywood-effects/comment-page-1/#comment-213</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Bourke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Feb 2009 05:10:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/?p=110#comment-213</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t completely agree with that assessment, Paul. Special effects have to be good enough to permit the suspension of disbelief, and are actually getting a lot cheaper. Many of the movies your comment criticises would be completely impossible to make ten or fifteen years ago; by far the fastest-rising componant of movie budgets over the last 20-30 years has been cast and crew salaries. That said, I definitely agree that a good plot line and developed characters are always better than the alternative. A complex storyline runs the risk of being confusing, but some movies go too far in the opposite direction.
   However, you don&#039;t seem to be making any allowance for the sense of wonder and total verisimilitude that good special effects can provide in service of a good storyline; your comments suggest a fundamental dichotomy between &#039;enjoyable on a repeat basis&#039; and &#039;special-effects heavy movies&#039;, and I think that&#039;s going a little too far.
   The point that I was making with the post was speculating about the consequences of improved special effects, not about the merits or lack thereof of movies that feature them. One of the movies that I keep turning back to for inspiration is &quot;John Carpentier&#039;s The Thing&quot;, and another is &quot;Aliens&quot; - both of which you would have to describe as special-effects driven.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t completely agree with that assessment, Paul. Special effects have to be good enough to permit the suspension of disbelief, and are actually getting a lot cheaper. Many of the movies your comment criticises would be completely impossible to make ten or fifteen years ago; by far the fastest-rising componant of movie budgets over the last 20-30 years has been cast and crew salaries. That said, I definitely agree that a good plot line and developed characters are always better than the alternative. A complex storyline runs the risk of being confusing, but some movies go too far in the opposite direction.<br />
   However, you don&#8217;t seem to be making any allowance for the sense of wonder and total verisimilitude that good special effects can provide in service of a good storyline; your comments suggest a fundamental dichotomy between &#8216;enjoyable on a repeat basis&#8217; and &#8217;special-effects heavy movies&#8217;, and I think that&#8217;s going a little too far.<br />
   The point that I was making with the post was speculating about the consequences of improved special effects, not about the merits or lack thereof of movies that feature them. One of the movies that I keep turning back to for inspiration is &#8220;John Carpentier&#8217;s The Thing&#8221;, and another is &#8220;Aliens&#8221; &#8211; both of which you would have to describe as special-effects driven.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul singleton</title>
		<link>http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/hollywood-effects/comment-page-1/#comment-207</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul singleton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Feb 2009 01:53:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/?p=110#comment-207</guid>
		<description>I think too much time and budget is spent on the special effects in the new movies. A better plot line and developed characters make a much more enjoyable movie. 
I think most of the movies you want to see again don&#039;t have that many special effects (as they are one shot wonders), but a complex story line leaves you thinking.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think too much time and budget is spent on the special effects in the new movies. A better plot line and developed characters make a much more enjoyable movie.<br />
I think most of the movies you want to see again don&#8217;t have that many special effects (as they are one shot wonders), but a complex story line leaves you thinking.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Bourke</title>
		<link>http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/hollywood-effects/comment-page-1/#comment-109</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Bourke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jan 2009 12:35:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/?p=110#comment-109</guid>
		<description>Your welcome, reader; glad you enjoyed it. Certainly, you can quote part of the blog post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your welcome, reader; glad you enjoyed it. Certainly, you can quote part of the blog post.</p>
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		<title>By: Your Reader</title>
		<link>http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/hollywood-effects/comment-page-1/#comment-106</link>
		<dc:creator>Your Reader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jan 2009 18:21:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/?p=110#comment-106</guid>
		<description>Good work! Thank you!
I always wanted to write in my blog something like that. Can I take part of your post to my site? 
Of course, I will add backlink?

Regards, Reader</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good work! Thank you!<br />
I always wanted to write in my blog something like that. Can I take part of your post to my site?<br />
Of course, I will add backlink?</p>
<p>Regards, Reader</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Bourke</title>
		<link>http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/hollywood-effects/comment-page-1/#comment-39</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Bourke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:42:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/?p=110#comment-39</guid>
		<description>@Ike: It sounds like your second cousin proves my point, Ike. Interesting to see my speculations proving accurate in at least one case. And don&#039;t worry about the length of replies; this post was intended to promote a dialogue that rises above the rhetoric that I&#039;ve been hearing about 4e for a while now, and examine one possible silver lining. 

@Samual: I have one &quot;New Gamer&quot; amongst those that I regularly GM; he joined in 4-5 years ago as a fresh-faced 16yo, having done nothing but computer-based RPGs and some Collectable Card Games. And he&#039;s struggled, in some respects, but has found the ability of a GM to customise a game to accommodate whatever the PLAYERS want to do too addictive to let go of. At about the same time, we had another &quot;New Gamer&quot; start up as well, and he grew fascinated by the idea of DMing, and proved a natural at it. He&#039;s since had to drop out due to university commitments, but we expect him back in 2010. So my thoughts had some basis in experience. But for every new player, there&#039;s one who&#039;se tried it and bailed, and 100 who&#039;ve never even thought about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Ike: It sounds like your second cousin proves my point, Ike. Interesting to see my speculations proving accurate in at least one case. And don&#8217;t worry about the length of replies; this post was intended to promote a dialogue that rises above the rhetoric that I&#8217;ve been hearing about 4e for a while now, and examine one possible silver lining. </p>
<p>@Samual: I have one &#8220;New Gamer&#8221; amongst those that I regularly GM; he joined in 4-5 years ago as a fresh-faced 16yo, having done nothing but computer-based RPGs and some Collectable Card Games. And he&#8217;s struggled, in some respects, but has found the ability of a GM to customise a game to accommodate whatever the PLAYERS want to do too addictive to let go of. At about the same time, we had another &#8220;New Gamer&#8221; start up as well, and he grew fascinated by the idea of DMing, and proved a natural at it. He&#8217;s since had to drop out due to university commitments, but we expect him back in 2010. So my thoughts had some basis in experience. But for every new player, there&#8217;s one who&#8217;se tried it and bailed, and 100 who&#8217;ve never even thought about it.</p>
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		<title>By: RPG Ike</title>
		<link>http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/hollywood-effects/comment-page-1/#comment-38</link>
		<dc:creator>RPG Ike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 01:50:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/?p=110#comment-38</guid>
		<description>Ahh... so many topics that I am passionate about. Thanks, Mike!

I think the reliance on CG visual effects (which are technically recognized as different from special effects, to my knowledge) is very bad for the overall quality of the movies we see—there&#039;s little reason for film-makers to hire good story-tellers when explosions and CG superheroes pull in hundreds of millions of dollars. I couldn&#039;t agree more that I love the technological advances and the ability to experience stories in ways we couldn&#039;t before, but I can&#039;t laud it beyond that because it&#039;s being, well, abused.

As a side note, try watching the Little Shop of Horrors movie and notice how convincing they could make a giant puppet way back in 1986. I wish they used puppetry like that for more movie monsters these days, as I find it easy to be jarred out of the story with current CG (although it is getting quite good).

I think people flock to their &#039;vices&#039; in tougher economic times, so (unfortunately) I predict that we&#039;ll continue to see CG-centric films at the box office, and I expect people will continue to go see them. Like roleplaying, it can actually be pretty cheap when compared to other hobbies.

Now, I&#039;m not going to paint myself as one, but as of right now I am definitely a 4E detractor. Still, my second-cousin is 16, and she got into D&amp;D right after 4E came out. The 9-10 players involved in that campaign are looking to branch out to other games with other GMs, and her little sister (14) wishes she could join them. I&#039;m not sure if that proves anything, but it&#039;s evidence that new players are out there.

I&#039;m not sure how I feel about Lingshu&#039;s ADHD comment (You sound like a fist-shaker, sir!) but I&#039;d wager a zillion gp that &#039;your&#039; Harry Potter idea is well in the works. If not, I&#039;d better contact J.K. about that. That, and read her books, I guess.

I hope Dan Howard is wrong... although really, I&#039;m not sure if his predictions coming true would be such a bad thing for people who enjoy tabletop RPGs. It&#039;s essentially a (growing) fringe hobby right now, as it has been since I started. I don&#039;t mind playing on the fringe. :)

Sorry about the length. Thanks again for the post.

&lt;abbr&gt;&lt;em&gt;RPG Ike’s last blog post..&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.unnatural20.com/blog/2009/1/16/are-there-any-antagonist-gms-in-the-audience-okay-ill-speak.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Are there any antagonist GMs in the audience? Okay, I’ll speak slower…&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/abbr&gt;&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ahh&#8230; so many topics that I am passionate about. Thanks, Mike!</p>
<p>I think the reliance on CG visual effects (which are technically recognized as different from special effects, to my knowledge) is very bad for the overall quality of the movies we see—there&#8217;s little reason for film-makers to hire good story-tellers when explosions and CG superheroes pull in hundreds of millions of dollars. I couldn&#8217;t agree more that I love the technological advances and the ability to experience stories in ways we couldn&#8217;t before, but I can&#8217;t laud it beyond that because it&#8217;s being, well, abused.</p>
<p>As a side note, try watching the Little Shop of Horrors movie and notice how convincing they could make a giant puppet way back in 1986. I wish they used puppetry like that for more movie monsters these days, as I find it easy to be jarred out of the story with current CG (although it is getting quite good).</p>
<p>I think people flock to their &#8216;vices&#8217; in tougher economic times, so (unfortunately) I predict that we&#8217;ll continue to see CG-centric films at the box office, and I expect people will continue to go see them. Like roleplaying, it can actually be pretty cheap when compared to other hobbies.</p>
<p>Now, I&#8217;m not going to paint myself as one, but as of right now I am definitely a 4E detractor. Still, my second-cousin is 16, and she got into D&amp;D right after 4E came out. The 9-10 players involved in that campaign are looking to branch out to other games with other GMs, and her little sister (14) wishes she could join them. I&#8217;m not sure if that proves anything, but it&#8217;s evidence that new players are out there.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not sure how I feel about Lingshu&#8217;s ADHD comment (You sound like a fist-shaker, sir!) but I&#8217;d wager a zillion gp that &#8216;your&#8217; Harry Potter idea is well in the works. If not, I&#8217;d better contact J.K. about that. That, and read her books, I guess.</p>
<p>I hope Dan Howard is wrong&#8230; although really, I&#8217;m not sure if his predictions coming true would be such a bad thing for people who enjoy tabletop RPGs. It&#8217;s essentially a (growing) fringe hobby right now, as it has been since I started. I don&#8217;t mind playing on the fringe. :)</p>
<p>Sorry about the length. Thanks again for the post.</p>
<p><abbr><em>RPG Ike’s last blog post..<a href="http://www.unnatural20.com/blog/2009/1/16/are-there-any-antagonist-gms-in-the-audience-okay-ill-speak.html" >Are there any antagonist GMs in the audience? Okay, I’ll speak slower…</a></em></abbr></p>
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		<title>By: Samuel Van Der Wall</title>
		<link>http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/hollywood-effects/comment-page-1/#comment-37</link>
		<dc:creator>Samuel Van Der Wall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 13:39:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/?p=110#comment-37</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t know any new gamers.  All of the recent additions we&#039;ve had to our group are old school gamers that, at some point, lost their original gaming groups.  It isn&#039;t like WoW or card games, where you run into people all the time who you never thought would play those games and they just started.

I&#039;m not sure how this trend can be reversed.  Like you said, people want someone else to do the heavy-lifting for them these days.

&lt;abbr&gt;&lt;em&gt;Samuel Van Der Wall’s last blog post..&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.roleplayingpro.com/2009/01/14/contest-results-sundered-skies-savage-worlds/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Contest Results: Sundered Skies &amp; Savage Worlds&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/abbr&gt;&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know any new gamers.  All of the recent additions we&#8217;ve had to our group are old school gamers that, at some point, lost their original gaming groups.  It isn&#8217;t like WoW or card games, where you run into people all the time who you never thought would play those games and they just started.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not sure how this trend can be reversed.  Like you said, people want someone else to do the heavy-lifting for them these days.</p>
<p><abbr><em>Samuel Van Der Wall’s last blog post..<a href="http://www.roleplayingpro.com/2009/01/14/contest-results-sundered-skies-savage-worlds/" >Contest Results: Sundered Skies &amp; Savage Worlds</a></em></abbr></p>
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		<title>By: Mike Bourke</title>
		<link>http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/hollywood-effects/comment-page-1/#comment-35</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Bourke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 08:16:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/?p=110#comment-35</guid>
		<description>Both Lingshu8 and Dan Howard have made excellent points that indicate how RPGs will have to evolve into the future if they are to sucessfully capture a new and wider audiance. They will need simpler options that permit optimisation of a set of tactical choices, and they will need to emphasise action and glitz more than in-depth intellect-oriented plotlines. More Jerry Bruckheimer (I love most of his movies and TV shows, but still...) and less Alfred Hitchcock. My point is that when you look into most of the criticism of D&amp;D 4e - and I&#039;ve been vocally and publicly critical prior to starting this blog - these are exactly the sort of changes that have been made, and that have so inflamed many of the older generation of &#039;traditional&#039; gamers. So the question you both raise, in essence, not whether or not 4e is an attempt to market to this audiance, but whether or not it has gone far enough...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Both Lingshu8 and Dan Howard have made excellent points that indicate how RPGs will have to evolve into the future if they are to sucessfully capture a new and wider audiance. They will need simpler options that permit optimisation of a set of tactical choices, and they will need to emphasise action and glitz more than in-depth intellect-oriented plotlines. More Jerry Bruckheimer (I love most of his movies and TV shows, but still&#8230;) and less Alfred Hitchcock. My point is that when you look into most of the criticism of D&#038;D 4e &#8211; and I&#8217;ve been vocally and publicly critical prior to starting this blog &#8211; these are exactly the sort of changes that have been made, and that have so inflamed many of the older generation of &#8216;traditional&#8217; gamers. So the question you both raise, in essence, not whether or not 4e is an attempt to market to this audiance, but whether or not it has gone far enough&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Howard</title>
		<link>http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/hollywood-effects/comment-page-1/#comment-34</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Howard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jan 2009 23:07:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.campaignmastery.com/blog/?p=110#comment-34</guid>
		<description>You&#039;re right: D&amp;D enables better stories and more flexible play.

But many people don&#039;t want that as much as they like games where the primary objective is to game the system.  In the old days, it was the rules lawyers and stats memorizers.  In 3e, it&#039;s the people who develop elaborate move/action combos and then just replay them repeatedly in games.

Card games and WOW cater to this urge, rather than subvert it.  The main enjoyment of these games comes from fine-tuning skill and strategy through repetition.  Role-playing, stories and flexibility are secondary and not the point.

I like D&amp;D and I like role-playing but I&#039;ve come to think that card games and WOW are the future ... because they give the majority of people what they want.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re right: D&amp;D enables better stories and more flexible play.</p>
<p>But many people don&#8217;t want that as much as they like games where the primary objective is to game the system.  In the old days, it was the rules lawyers and stats memorizers.  In 3e, it&#8217;s the people who develop elaborate move/action combos and then just replay them repeatedly in games.</p>
<p>Card games and WOW cater to this urge, rather than subvert it.  The main enjoyment of these games comes from fine-tuning skill and strategy through repetition.  Role-playing, stories and flexibility are secondary and not the point.</p>
<p>I like D&amp;D and I like role-playing but I&#8217;ve come to think that card games and WOW are the future &#8230; because they give the majority of people what they want.</p>
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